The Apple Blossom Volume 2, Number 6

The Apple Blossom (TAB) How did you get involved with computers in general, and the Apple II in particular?

Gary Utter (GU) Once upon a time, Ed Reppert (Chief Sysop of the MacPro RoundTable on GEnie, and my college roommate) was in the Navy. He asked me to hold his Black Bell & Howell Apple II while he was overseas. I spent countless hours playing W izardry, until I found enough exploitable bugs to allow me to beat the game regularly. Then I gave it up. When Ed came home on leave, we went down to the local Apple dealer to check out the recently rolled out Lisa, and I fell in love. Then I heard the p rice.
I had nothing to do with computers for several years after that. Then my wife, The Lovely Susan, decided that she wanted a computer to use with her small business. Since I am in charge of all matters dealing with hardware, it was my job to pick one out, buy it, and set it up. After a lot of careful shopping, I decided on an Apple II (and I'll tell you flat out that I WOULD have bought a Macintosh Plus if I'd had the money). In fact, I decided on a Laser 128ex, because I could put together a complete sys tem for under $900. I did that, and it was a beauty.
I had a 128K //c clone, with an amber monitor, a Panasonic printer, a couple of boxes of disks, and a pirated copy of Appleworks 1.0. (Why buy software when you can get it from your friends?)
I spent 10 hours the first night we had it, building a home for it, and starting to get the software set up. The next day I went out and got a pirate copy of MultiScribe (no docs, of course), and spent another 10 hours tinkering with the machine. The nex t day was my day off, so I went out and bought a mouse, and a copy of GeoWorks. Lovely program. It made that Laser look just like the old Lisa. I wanted it so bad I actually bought it. My friends didn't understand that, they thought I was crazed. But I w as already beginning to understand that piracy was not only wrong, but plain stupid.
Understand that, at this point, it was still Susan's computer; I was just getting it set up for her. I'd spent my time with a computer, that old Bell & Howell, and I really wasn't interested in them anymore. I just wanted to get the thing right for Susan .
The next day I went out and bought 128K of additional RAM (it only cost me $98 too). And I figured an external disk drive would be a good idea, so I bought one of those too.
The only problem I had was that various parts of the computer kept breaking. The first Laser went up in smoke the night we brought it home (plugged it in, and it literally smoked--we rushed back to the dealer and got another just before closing time). Th e external floppy had to be replaced twice, and when the second computer just plain stopped working, I decided that buying a Laser had been a false economy. So, after less than three weeks of ownership, I traded it in on an Apple. Choosing between a IIGS and a //e was a no brainer. The price of a //e with 128K, two floppy drives, a serial printer card, a mouse and mouse card was higher than the price of a IIGS, which had all that stuff built in. And, the dealer let me swap the 128K memory card for an Ap plied Engineering GSRam, which would let me use that 128K I had bought for the Laser to push the thing up to a massive 768K. Of course, that cost me a few dollars extra.
So, in three weeks I had upgraded from a $900 //c knockoff to a 768K IIGS with a color monitor. And it had only cost me about $1800.
But those 140K floppys were eating me out of house and home. I decided I just had to have one of those huge 800K 3.5 drives. So I got one. That let me use the IIGS System Software v1.8. Even nicer than GeoWorks, that was, even more like a Lisa. At this p oint, I had spent as much as it would have cost me to buy a 1 meg Mac Plus, which was about as much like a Lisa as you could get in those days, but I wasn't in the mood to look back.

TAB From what I know of you, it's always seemed to me that telecommunications was a big area of interest to you. What drew you to this area of computing?

GU Within about 6 weeks of my initial purchase of the Laser, Ed Reppert suggested that I should get a modem. I didn't see any point in it, but Ed swore to me that I needed one, and offered to sell me his 1200 baud Apple brand modem for only $15 0. I could even pay him for it later, or give it back if I didn't like it. Such a deal!
I hooked up the modem, and signed up for the 10 free hours on GEnie, and the 10 free hours on Compuserve Information Services (CIS), and the 10 free hours on The Source. Then I went out and got a copy of MouseTalk 1.3.
I got on GEnie and started finding my way around. I captured everything to my printer (I didn't know about the capture buffer yet). I found simply fascinating sources of information online. I wanted to know everything I could about my new toy (by this ti me, both Susan and I recognized that she didn't have a computer). I read fascinating discussions of my new machine between people like Loren Damewood and Merry Perry and Shawn Gooden on CIS, and LINEFEED and UNCLE-DOS and T.ZUCHOWSKI on GEnie.
Pretty soon, I learned about the capture buffer, and MouseTalk macros, and offline reading and replying. I gave up on Compuserve. Their 1200 baud rate was $12/hour, and GEnies was only $8 (of course, they didn't have 2400 baud access here, but then, I di dn't have a 2400 baud modem, so what did I care?). I had to be careful about logging on during Prime Time, though, because the surcharge was $35/hour.
I devoured information, and ran up GEnie bills of several hundred dollars a month. I devised my own posting macros for MouseTalk and composed my replies in the MouseTalk editor (I tried Appleworks, but I never learned to like it). Tom Hoover came out wit h GEM about then, but I wasn't going to pay for something that I could do perfectly well by myself. Besides, it didn't work with MouseTalk, and I always wanted to be in the GUI interface, even in 8 bit.
Before too long, I discovered that I knew the answer to a lot of people's questions, and that I got better information from other people when they knew I was a contributor myself (i.e. when they knew they didn't have to feed me the information in baby ta lk).
Then I got a 2400 baud modem. CIS's rates for 2400 were the same as their 1200 rates, so with a 2400 baud, I could spend time on CIS for less per hour than I could on GEnie (effectively). I didn't abandon GEnie, but I started spending more time on CIS th an I did on GEnie. CIS had (among other things) Master Message Manager, a lovely BASIC program that fulfilled all the functions of an off line reader, assuming you could write your own macros to actually read messages and post replies, and by then I coul d do that in my sleep (in MouseTalk).
By then I was spending $300-$400 per month on GEnie and CIS combined, and I still couldn't get all the information I wanted, so I got some service whose name I no longer remember that let me dial local BBSes (Bulletin Board Services) all over the country for a flat rate of $30 a month.
Now the taps were open full blast. I could spend as much time as I wanted online, learning and teaching. And suddenly I found that there wasn't enough information out there to satisfy me.
Then GEnie announced Star*Services (which became GEnie Basic). Finally, I had found my place. Well, not quite--that happened when I was hired as an assistant in the Jerry Pournelle RoundTable.

TAB I've really felt one of the strongest points about the Apple II has been telecommunications, and despite the fact that we don't have a graphical web browser for use with the World Wide Web, I still feel the same way. Would you agree or disa gree, and either way, why?

GU I admit to never having tried an Atari or an Amiga, but I use Macs, and Windows boxes, and the Apple II (especially the IIGS) is head and shoulders above both of them when it comes to telecommunications capabilities. It's not the hardware th at makes it so, it's the software, and the attitude of the people who write it.
I'm confident that we will get TCP/IP capability for (at least) the IIGS, probably within the next year (yes, I know some things, no, I can't talk about them). Once we have TCP/IP (or compatibility with the protocols, which is good enough), a usable grap hic World Wide Web browser won't be far behind. I say "usable", because I don't think it will be truly graphical. A good Web browser for the GS will read HTML and interpret it for the SHR screen, while not downloading the actual graphics displayed on Web pages. Generally speaking, the graphics add glitz, but unless you are looking specifically for graphical information, they don't add usability. A browser that replaces "in line" graphics with simple buttons would likely be one heck of a lot faster than a "full graphical" browser, and could be the next "killer app".

TAB What do you see as the future of telecommunications? It seems like a lot of the major online services are losing out to the Internet; will we see the Internet eventually overwhelm all of the online services?

GU The Internet is like the Borg. Eventually, all online services will simply be places on the 'Net. It is likely that they will also be Internet Service Providers with nationwide coverage. Compuserve already IS, effectively, a nationwide ISP, and America OnLine has just announced a flat rate plan which will make them a national ISP for all practical purposes. The problem with those services (from an Apple II perspective) is that they do not provide any significant text based access (CIS still maintains text access in some areas, like the Apple II area, but the system as a whole does not offer significant support for text users).

TAB How does the Apple II fit into what you see as this future?

GU As long as you can get on the 'Net in the first place, there is plenty that you can do with an Apple II. Even now, without TCP/IP, a dialup shell from a local ISP, and a text based browser like Lynx gives you access to almost all of the usef ul information out there. The learning curve is steep, but once you've mastered it, an Apple II is a fast and powerful tool for gathering things from the 'Net. As the desirability of being on the 'Net becomes more clear to the Apple II community, Apple I I people will develop II specific software that will likely yield some really serious tools for this purpose.

TAB Like a lot of other Apple II users, you also use other computer platforms; what's interesting to me is that you use the MacOS, the Apple II, and Windows; usually people just use two of the three. Could you give me a brief rundown on what ki nd of differences there are between the three systems?

GU The hardest thing to learn was that they are all the same. Whether you are running ProDOS, just plain DOS, GS/OS, Mac OS, Windows 3.1 or Windows 95, they are all just computer programs. There are differences (and frustrations) in dealing wit h each particular user interface, but once you understand that what they are doing is all the same, it becomes pretty easy. A "config.sys" file is just setting system parameters and loading things that are equivalent to Inits on the GS or Extensions on t he Mac. On the GS, you set the system parameters with the Control Panel. The interface is vastly different, but the goal, and the effect, are the same.
DOS and ProDOS do the same thing, the commands and prompts are different, but really, a command line interface is a command line interface. You just need to know the commands and how they work. And if you understand in general how they work, you don't ev en have to know them, as long as you have a reference text handy.
On the face of it, each OS is different, but the difference is not significantly greater than that between, say, a compact car and a 3/4 ton pickup truck. If you can drive one, you can drive the other, all you have to do is get used to it.

TAB Do you have a "dream computer"? Would you like to combine parts of the different operating systems you use to make a new kind of system? What would it be like? How about in hardware?

GU Well, my dream computer is a small black box implanted just above my left hip and wired into my nervous system, with a display that hooks to my optic nerves, and input taken directly from my spinal nerves, but that still needs a bit of desig n work, so let's talk about what we might be able to get in the relatively near future.
The Apple/IBM joint platform, based on the PowerPC RISC chip looks to be the perfect platform for future development. We have recently seen the announcement of a PowerPC chip that clocks out at over 500mhz, and that is just the third generation chip. Wit hin the next 18 months we should see PPC chips operating at more than 1000mhz (or, at worst, dual processor machines equipped with two of these 500mhz jobs).
Anything a "normal" user could want to do could be accomplished on one of those things (but experience will tell you that in 36 months a 1000mhz machine will be considered "obsolete").
As far as operating systems go, my imagination is somewhat limited. Win 95 does a few nice tricks that I'd like to see done on the Mac (and that, incidentally, I suggested to Jim Merrit for GS System Software v5.x). Win 95 is, itself, a first generation attempt to turn out a true competitor for the Mac OS. I would expect Win 97 to be somewhat close to where the Mac OS is right now.
What I would really like to see in this regard is an erasure of "cross platform" barriers. I'd like to be able to load up a Windows application on the Mac without having to dance through hoops and pay a speed penalty. I'd like to be able to load up a Mac application in Win 95.
That's not going to happen, of course. But what IS going to happen is a new OS for the combined Apple/IBM hardware platform, and THAT OS will be able to load either Mac or Windows applications without any difficulty. Not that there will be much distincti on between the two by then.

TAB I've spoken a lot about The Apple II Community in various articles I've written, and you've also talked about The Apple II Community. What's your definition of it?

GU I tried to coin a new term at KFest, that being the _A2_ community. It has a certain cachet, in my opinion, as well as a strong basis in reality (plus, it's easier to say and write).
The A2 community is nothing more, and nothing less, than a group of people who share a common interest, and a common way of working with each other. There is a spirit here, which, despite being anchored to an "obsolete" and even "antique" computer, looks to the future rather than the past. Many, perhaps most of us have moved on to other platforms to a greater or lesser degree (I'm composing this on a really serious PowerMac, but I'm using WriteAway as my word processor, running it under an Apple IIGS em ulator). But we all have a warm place for the Apple II in our hearts, and our homes (I recently sold off two of my GS systems, leaving me with just one and a spare).
What is important, however, is not the hardware I'm using, or even the software, but the way I look at the world. The march of technology has, in fact, made the Apple II obsolete (although I am doing nothing on this machine that I couldn't do on the GS s itting on the other desk). The Ford Model A is obsolete too, but it is still every bit as good a car as it was when it was new, and it will do things that you simply can't do with a new Taurus. There is a big difference between "obsolete" and "dead".
As long as we share this interest in the Apple II, and as long as we work together as a community, what computer we actually use for our day to day work is not significant. I want former Apple II users (and A2 users) to be able to feel comfortable in thi s group, to continue to participate, to enjoy that feeling of community that we have built over the years. And I want people who are still using only their Apple II for day to day work (or play) to feel that they are not freaks or outcasts. So long as we continue to support each other, this will happen.

TAB One of the key parts of your message was "diversification"; that we need to diversify our online efforts in order to survive long term. What does that entail?

GU Basically, it entails developing resources, primarily online, so that we are never again dependent on only one service for a place to base our community. At the same time, more and different ways for people to meet online means that more peo ple who have not formerly had any easy way to access online information about the A2 community will be able to do so. Specifics would be too long a discussion.

TAB I still consider Genie (the name of the online service was changed slightly following its sale) the center of the Apple II universe; how is that changing, and is that change for the better or worse?

GU Genie is, in my opinion, doomed. Certainly it is doomed as a text based service, the only question is how long it will be before the end. To my certain knowledge, the end is not more than 18 months away (I'd prefer not to publicly reveal my source for that, but it's solid). My personal opinion is that the end is more likely less than 3-4 months away. I'd call that a change for the worse, whichever time frame you use.

TAB You're involved with Syndicomm, one of the better known companies that support the Apple II. Can you tell our readers what Syndicomm's about?

GU Syndicomm is about keeping the A2 community alive, or at least that's how it started. To make a long story short (and therefore slightly inaccurate), when Tom Weishaar decided that he could no longer make a living at serving the Apple II mar ket, Dean and I bought out his interest in Syndicomm. More than anything else, we did that because we didn't think there was anyone who could do it better (and because we wanted to do it ourselves). We've branched out a lot since then, with a number of o nline areas aside from A2 and A2Pro, but basically, what Syndicomm does is run RoundTables, Forums, call them what you will, on as many services and in as many places as we can reach. But our home base, and our power base, has always been the A2 communit y. So long as we can keep that community healthy, Syndicomm will be healthy. By pouring time and effort in A2, we serve our own ends, as well as serving the community as a whole.

TAB I know you have a few projects coming up that will be of interest to Apple II users, primarily on Delphi. Can you go ahead and tell us some about those?

GU We've recently opened up an A2 Forum on Delphi, along with an A2Pro Forum, a PowerMac & PowerPC Forum, a ShowBiz Forum and a Mobile Computing Forum. By the time this hits print, we should have a MacPro Forum and a Jerry Pournelle Forum open as well. As of the time of this writing, there is much of this that is still "under construction", less for our areas than for Delphi as a whole.
Right now, as I write this, A2, POWER and MOBILE are available from Delphis main "Computing & Technology" menu. (Simply log in to Delphi and type GO COM A2 to get to the A2 Forum.) Within a few more weeks, these areas will also be available from Delphis Web site.
For those of you who have "gone over to the Dark Side", using IBMs or Macs, you can point your Web browser to Delphi.com, log in, and go to the A2 Forum via that browser, reading messages, downloading files, etc, right there. Just because you own and use something other than an Apple II doesn't mean you have to give up your membership in the A2 community. That's part of what we want everyone to understand. A2 is always home, even if you have moved away, you can always come back to visit your friends.
Delphi was purchased by new owners in June of '96, one of those new owners being Bill Louden, the man who founded Genie (and helped found CIS). In my personal pantheon of heroes, he stands shoulder to shoulder with UNCLE-DOS.
The new owners are making Delphi fully accessible from the Internet and as a text based service. For the first time, a user will be able to access the message bases and conferences on an online service with either a text based machine or a graphically ba sed machine. There will be only one common message base, used by both modes of access. They are expanding and changing the service as I write this, and detailing the changes is beyond my capacity at this point. Suffice it to say that Delphi is leading th e way into the future of online services under the guidance of one of the proven greats of this business, and Syndicomm is going along for the ride. We plan to take A2 users from all over the world along with us.

TAB What's the plan for software support for Apple II users on Delphi? Are there front ends or offline navigators available, and if not, is there a plan for those?

GU We're working on a Delphi version of CoPilot for the Apple IIGS right now, and a Mac version is being developed concurrently (in fact, they are the same application, being written in "portable" code, only the scripts will differ). We are als o working on an 8 bit version of CoPilot for //e and //c users.

TAB How about access? What kinds of ways are there to access Delphi? Are there nodes nationwide, or worldwide?

GU Delphi is accessible world wide, via Telnet over the Internet. There are also a lot of local access numbers within the continental United States. Explaining all the different ways too access is extremely complicated, however, and I don't wan t to attempt it here.

TAB What's the one thing you'd like to be remembered for by the Apple II community?

GU Keeping it alive. (I'd also like to be remembered as being rich, powerful, handsome, intelligent, charming and incredibly suave, but I have to be realistic.)